12.06.2012 User Meetup

Owned by Ed Cable
Last updated: Dec 10, 2012

Agenda

Before each meeting we'll post a proposed agenda.  You can add any item you would like to cover to the agenda by emailing the user list or editing this wiki page. 

Session

Description

Presenter

Time

Introduction

We will also have an introduction of everyone on the call so the community can get more personally connected.

Ed Cable

5 min

Implementer Show & Tell

n/an/a

 

Discussion

RHoK Update

John/Keith Woodlock

10 min

Demo/Tutoria4

Demo of Mifos X Fixed Deposits Functionality

Shiva & Madhukar (Hugo)

40 min

Open Office HoursSupport/feedback 5 min

On the Call

  • Binny - Pune, India
  • Shiva - Hugo, Hyderabad, India
  • Lukasz - SolDevelo, Poland
  • Thomas - Vastech - Uganda
  • Zayyad - Intrasoft - Kenya
  • Lassaad - enda, Tunisia
  • Keith  - COSM, Ireland
  • Madhukar - Hugo - India
  • John - COSM, Ireland
  • Ed - COSM, USA
  • Vishwas - Conflux, India

Notes

From: http://sync.in/97GWFrn4rk

Background behind Fixed Deposits
  • Hugo came onto around Mifos X in August time frame, working on savings/other fixed deposits features.
  • Not yet in the official Mifos X release but will come in during 2nd release after the loan and clien work. 
  • Shiva: were targeting a new segmen of customers that aren't MFIs, NBFCs
  • Targeting employee cooperatives in other regions - thousands in the region but are a couple types targeting
  • Employees cooperative unions which are in place for every state dept. plus mutually cooperative societies (MF banks)
  • Needed the fixed deposit and recurring deposit functionalities to fill gaps that were in Mifos. 
  • Implemented product successfully three days ago at one customer location. 
  • Were slightly behind on recurring deposits but have fixed deposits complete. 
  • About Madhukar
  • Spearheading this development and doing testing/implementation of product all by Madhukar after Shiva did initial requirements gathering. 
  • About the Feature
  • Renewal Allowed - if this is checked - will allow a customer to renew their fixed deposit after the year long term has been completed
  • Once batch jobs are available in product this renewal will actually be done automatically if the customer has chosen
  • Pre-Closure Allowed - once a customer has subscribed to fixed tenure and might want to do early withdrawal with a penalty
  • Interest Compounding - 2 types of interest - simple or compound
  • Lock-in Period: if deposit for one year, deposit must be in place for min time before can withdraw any funds. 
  • Maturity Default Interest Rate: rate if they have complete term of deposit
  • Minimum interest rate through Max - range
  • Pre-closure rate: rate if they withdraw early.


  • Creating an Account
  • Also have option once account created and approved can print the details of fixed deposit - the certificate for the customer. 
  • Transactions
  • Can withdraw whole deposit before tenure (if pre-closure allowed)
  • Can withdraw just interest as well - 
  • Before doing this can manually post interest 
  • Zayyad: can interest posting be automated - (i.e. during month-end procedure)
  • Shiva: this is planned - waiting on framework of batch job schedulers. 
  • Ed: when interest withdrawn - need to make it clear it's being subtracted - not that clear. 
  • Keith: what if the withdrawal took place yesterday? Can I select a date on when interest was withdrawn?
  • would make sense to support back-dating if possible - should have ability but could then constrain whether or not to allow backdating.
  • Binny: Does it make sense to generate and display a unique txn id for withdrawals and perhaps for interest postings too?
  • Very important for manual maintenance of accounting
  • Binny: can tenure be set to something outside of the default? Yes.
  • A bit misleading from product creation perspective so let's improve. 
  • Shiva: as a future enhancements could define slabs (ranges) and then you could assign interest rates per slab
  • i.e. 3-6 months, 6-9 months, 9-12 months 


  • Withdrawal
  • Happens at maturity or before maturity (at pre-closure rate)
  • For interest that is not posted - will calculate it at pre-closure rate. 
  • Zayyad: based on his experiences - interest is normally acrrued on daily basis - at end of every month it's posted to the account meaning that FD has earned that interest - if client goes to bank before month-end will only give what they be accrued
  • Ed's scenario - client has been withdrawing interest at full rate but pre-closes the deposit before term matures, what happens to interest that has already been paid?
  • Binny: could apply a fee/penalty at pre-closure that would give MFI a legal way to get back additional interest that was paid. 
  • Shiva; this scenario doesn't happen with their cooperative as interest is done yearly. 
  • Discussion on Account Renewal
  • Will be one year out into the future + one day. 
  • Zayyad: could this remaining balance also be transferred to a regular savings accoun
  • Shiva: once conept of batch jobs/schedulers is added in - could automatically become a savings account rather than a fixed deposit
  • Zayyad: would be good to have a window in which to choose - either cash withdrawal, transfer to savings, or automatic renewal. 
Potential Enhancements
  • Automatic transfer to savings
  • Definining interest rate slabs
[8:07:10 AM] Keith Woodlock: what if the withdrawal took place yesterday?
[8:07:22 AM] Keith Woodlock: i cant select a date on when interest was withdrawn?
[8:09:24 AM] binny.gopinath: also .. does it make sense to generate and display a unique txn id for withdrawals and perhaps for interest postings too?
[8:15:45 AM] Edward Cable: What if they do a pre-closure but have already withdrawn interest at the normal rate?
[8:16:01 AM] Edward Cable: rather than the lower pre-closure rate?
[8:16:32 AM] binny.gopinath: i guess it is done at 6% (interest rate on pre-closure)
[8:17:15 AM] Edward Cable: but if they had already taken money out at normal rate - would they pay back he difference?
[8:17:50 AM] Zayyad A Said: I think interest withdrawal should not be at normal rate if before maturity
[8:17:57 AM] Zayyad A Said: but at pre-closure rate
[8:19:38 AM] binny.gopinath: Agree with Ed and Zayyad .. most banks practice is that way i believe
[8:20:20 AM] Zayyad A Said: Banks calculate FD interest on daily accrual
[8:20:20 AM] Ndugwa Thomas: Yes agree with Zayyad only Interst posted should be the only amt available
[8:20:37 AM] Zayyad A Said: 365 days or 360 based on preference
[8:25:22 AM] binny.gopinath: if there is a way to apply a penalty or fee to the account, this may give a legal way to charge a penalty even if interest is posted
[8:27:38 AM] Zayyad A Said: I will confirm this with the local bankers and post it on JIRA
[8:29:19 AM] Edward Cable: does the external ID not get automatically generated and moved forward?
[8:29:58 AM] binny.gopinath: Or rather .. we need an account number so that customer can reference this in any communications etc
[8:30:11 AM] Keith Woodlock: The external Id field is not meant to represent the actual account number
[8:30:20 AM] Zayyad A Said: Account number will be much better i guess
[8:30:23 AM] Keith Woodlock: Its intention was to be used for migrating from one system to another
[8:31:00 AM] Edward Cable: ah okay - thanks for clarification keith.
[8:31:17 AM] Hugo Technologies: Normally Instituions maintain the FD certificates....... it has its unique number
[8:31:20 AM] Keith Woodlock: but it does look as if madhukar is using it as an actuall account number?
[8:31:54 AM] Keith Woodlock: so they expect the data entry people to enter the certification number here?
[8:33:53 AM] Zayyad A Said: The pre printed certificates are serialed but CBS also auto-generate FD account number
[8:38:47 AM] Hugo Technologies: yeah...... they are entering the certificate number manually
[8:39:12 AM] Zayyad A Said: What if one tries to forge the certificate?
Random Hacks of Kindness Update
  • John: hackathon in three sites (SF, Bangalore, Dublin) - working on our problems - most worked on mobile
  • 1 guy worked on building a small app on iPhone, another doing the same work on Android but with offline capability
  • Was useful to see how easy it as given a specific scope how both the iPhone or Android work could be done.
  • John: won't automatically rebuild the full capability of Mifos X in mobile - first want to see someone's detailed mobile strategy and requirements before we build them in.
  • Will be there for anyone that needs mobile or SMS technology but want it to be requirements-driven. 
  • Hackathon proved that mobile developmen can be done with relative ease through the API on Mifos X - we simply need actual requirements and users to build for.
  • Vishwas: did a small mobile app with Phonegap that works offine too. Small progress on client doc module.